Dani Finishes Direct Testimony: Her Family Remains Divided, but Dani Has a New Life

In General

By Dianne Lipson

Dani finished her direct testimony on May 30 and began cross examination. She was wearing a dressy white shirt tucked into a narrow black skirt.  She looked fabulous. She has a really thin figure. She’s an attractive woman. I think, if she were a few inches taller, she would have been a fashion model.

Here is the final chapter of Dani’s direct testimony, as she more or less concludes her riveting story:

After she confronted Keith at volleyball [after being confined in a room for nearly two years – to heal the ethical breach of kissing another man] and Keith, seeing her, ran away and hid, and she was escorted out of the volleyball court. It was now time for her to leave the US.

[It was February 2012 and it may be no coincidence that this was when the Albany Times Union was publishing its stunning series, Secrets of Nxivm. Did Raniere consent to Dani leaving Albany out of fear of the Times Union adding her confinement story to their expose series? Raniere was under incredible stress at that time because of the damning stories in the Times Union. His pedophilia was being exposed. Of course, law enforcement in the Albany area did nothing about it. Just as he crafted a fake story about his child not being his son, Raniere crafted a fake story about the Times Union. He said that all the women in the story who said he was a pedophile, a rapist and a monster were paid by the Times Union to tell those lies. He pretty much got away with it too. His main body of followers stuck to him. But the Times Union series probably saved many from joining this cult of horrors.]

So Dani left the U.S. She was driven from Albany to the Mexico border by her father, accompanied by Kristin Keeffe. On the trip, Dani stole some money from her father’s wallet.

Assistant US Attorney Moira Penza asked her, “Why didn’t you ask for the money?”

Dani said, “it was a condition [imposed by Raniere] that they were going to give me nothing.”

[That’s right: Raniere’s condition was that Dani was to be dropped off in Mexico without a dime to her name and no ID either.]

On the way, Dani confessed to her dad that she took the money and gave it back because she wanted to come clean.

At the border, she was met by her father’s accountant who drove her to the bus station where she took a bus to her chosen destination. Just before crossing the border, she finally got a moment alone with her dad. He gave her 1500 pesos [$76.22]. [Nice dad].

They cried. Her father, Hector, said, “Please do everything you need to do to get back to us.” Meaning the Nxivm world he was engulfed in.

Daniela was frugal with her money. She had no phone, no computer, nothing. But she wasted no time. She found a hostel to live in. She found a job very quickly at a computer store, replacing someone who was on pregnancy leave.

She was still required to do book reports for Raniere. So she went to the library to get a library card. Without ID, it wasn’t supposed to be possible. But a man who worked there was so pleased that she was interested in reading that he co-signed for her to get her a library card.

She had no birth certificate and, in Mexico, you need a birth certificate to get your other ID. Daniela did other jobs. She had four jobs at one time. She managed a restaurant in a boutique hotel, she did websites, she was an English language teacher. She taught tennis and English to children. The mother of one of these children was a lawyer for the Human Rights Commission.

When Dani told this woman she had no ID, the human rights lawyer said, “Having an identity is a human right, I will get you your birth certificate.” The Human Rights Commission paid for her to get a birth certificate. Getting the birth certificate [which Raniere had withheld from her] was life changing.

About a year after she returned to Mexico [2013], it turned out that Nxivm’s Mexico leader, Emiliano Salinas [the son of the former president of Mexico, Carlos Salinas] was planning to marry the famous actress Ludwika Paleta and, by chance, they were to have their reception in the very same boutique hotel where Dani was managing a restaurant. She saw Nxians all over her city.

“Just my luck,” she said.

But Daniela had her life back now. She didn’t need her family or Raniere or Lauren Salzman for ID papers. She could move on.  Still, when all these Nxians were in the city, she met with Lauren.

Dani said, “It was like two worlds colliding. Like two worlds clashing.”

Lauren asked Dani, “How are you doing on your program [meaning her Keith-prescribed and totally controlled life. “Program” was a euphemism for slavery to Keith].

Dani realized she just did not care about that anymore.

Over the next few years, Dani moved up and onward to succeed. In time, she got an important job as a plant manager. She now travels, as a representative of the company, all over the world.

Dani testified, “I realized I was not going to change the world.”  She just wanted her own life. She even got a boyfriend.

“It was a long process of rebuilding every part of my existence that had been destroyed,” she testified.

As for her family, thanks to Raniere, they are still not united, as they were before they met a man named Raniere.

There is some progress though. Dani testified that, during the interval since she left the cult of horrors, she has reunited with her mother. Her mother found her, contacted her and came and saw her.

When they first met, Dani actually screamed at her mother, “Why didn’t you come and get me?”

Her mother just listened silently and then apologized. They worked things out.

She also had a long phone conversation with her brother Adrian, or as Keith and everyone called him, “Fluffy.”

On the phone – her mother was present – Dani finally explained everything that happened to her, including that she had sex with Keith.

Fluffy, who was still in the cult then, said, “I’m not saying that I don’t believe you, but do you have any proof?”

She forwarded to him a bunch of emails. [Fluffy has since left the cult with his wife Chelsea, who was also a former cult member.]

Dani also met with her elder sister, Mariana [once her best friend – pre-Raniere] and her father, Hector, in Mexico. Mariana was having immigration issues then. [Mariana is still a Raniere follower and has Raniere’s son, Kemar, who is now almost two years old. They live in Mexico. Both father and Mariana remain enmeshed in the Raniere doctrines and wait for their Vanguard to be acquitted – an unlikely eventuality.]

As for the younger sister, Cami, she was lured to stay in Nxivm with a promise of a very big salary to work at Rainbow Cultural Gardens [Raniere’s child abuse program] in Guadalajara Mexico.

[As Frank Report revealed prior to the trial, Cami is working there under Nxivm leader Jack Levy. But it is extremely doubtful she is getting the big salary she was promised.]

Dani testified that Cami has made some non-Nxivm progress.  She has some [non-Nxivm] friends [which is not usually allowed]. Cami also changed her looks by cutting her hair [also not allowed] and dying it blond.

At this time, the family is divided, perhaps never to reunite. But there is some hope, as the years go by, and Raniere festers in prison, that Cami, Mariana and their father, Hector, will stop imbibing the Raniere Kool-Aid.

Dani did, and her life – at age 33 – has just begun.

Stay tuned for Dani’s cross-examination, which began on May 30 and will continue on May 31.

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65 commentsOn Dani Finishes Direct Testimony: Her Family Remains Divided, but Dani Has a New Life

  • Discrediting news and other sources is MLM 101. A continuous effort should be applied to refute this. For example, if the NXIVM 9 had started a website, they could have repeately refuted being paid for the Times Union stories, along with the Times Union itself. Instead, they let it drop and the carnage continued.

    • Mr. Johnson

      Please give credit where credit is due. TU and N9 did their part. No one can do it all.

      You seem to love to have all the attention center around you. You want to give advice to everyone but the nature of your advice is “canned” or “out of a manual”.

      May I suggest that you go live your life instead of commenting on what you see as the mistakes of everyone else’s life. Please report back to us how you plan to lead a brave life, assist humanity, create a work of art, build a great business or simply how you plan to be humble.

      • LOL

        You have a better chance of asking God to hurry up and send the Messiah….

        …… What’s the harm in trying, right?

  • https://www.instagram.com/p/ByIRdCSnXpA/

    “The following excerpt is from early in the book and describes a feeling I have had so often (I imagine many of you have felt this as well)–that someone wants something from me but, as they aren’t directly presenting that want, I doubt myself and my judgement, thus allowing that person more access than I would have knowing their true intentions”

    Keith Raniere?

    You were named in the same articles that revealed your cult leader raped little girls. You were named in a lawsuit as a likely future defendant. Hush.

  • That bastard better watch his step when cross-examining her. I bet there are a lot people following her testimony that are feeling very protective of Dani right now.

  • Bravo, Dani, for your bravery, your strength to relive this horror, and for taking your life back. BRAVO!

  • Good for you Dani!!!!! Animo!!!

  • “cutting her hair [also not allowed.]” SO many cults require this kind of crap!! Amish, Mennonites, LDS (Mormons), Apostolics, Orthodox Jews, and on and on. Legalism! How women, and sometimes men, groom themselves is controlled by a CONTROL FREAK! God is NOT a control freak! That is why being a Christian is not slavery, not negative. It is a CHOICE! Well, that feels better. Thank you.

    • I totally subscribe. I once saw an interview of a Muslim young woman who stated that wearing that black bedsheet on top of her head was “a right not an obligation”!! LOL These people are off with the fairies into another realm! Has anyone tried wearing a black baseball cap for hours walking outside in high temperatures? 😀
      Ok, I’m an atheist, so am not singling out Muslims. It’s like all these brainwashed beings live in the Lord of the Rings and don’t want to come out! LOL I know, it is not funny but the craziness of these people is so fundamental that I can’t have another reaction.

      • Quite a few religious sects that strongly adhere to the Old Testament have women cover their heads, including the Amish and Mennonites, and Ultra-Orthodox Jews – some of the most strictly observant, Haredi Jews, even wear burqas. And some of the Orthodox Jewish attire for men, including large (always dark) and even fur-covered hats, and long coats, seems equally impractical.

        One curious aspect most people aren’t aware of, is that many observant Orthodox women aren’t obvious on the street, because they wear wigs as a head covering, in seemingly very legalistic adherence!

        • Many religions have an obsession with keeping the womenfolk pure and under wraps. Strict guardianship laws are in effect in many Muslim countries, the hijab mandatory. Christianity wasn’t any different, a few centuries ago. The idea of a woman wearing pants and a tee shirt in the summer is a quite modern concept and part of the liberty of enlightened secular life.

          Keith Raniere subscribed to that Old Testament standard. He fit the model of a patriarch, with multiple “wives”, with one set of rules for him, a quite different set of rules for them. The frenzy of moral outrage that one of “his” women so much as kissed another man is indicative. His whole program was quite regressive; the precise opposite of what it sold itself as being– some short of enlightened new dawn.

          It’s bizarre to me that the women put up with him, classic male chauvinist pig that he is. It was all so transparently regressive and completely out of touch with the modern zeitgeist. In this post- Harvey Weinstein, #MeToo era. Triply bizarre that someone like Allison Mack was onboard with this, while proclaiming her feminist goals, all about empowerment. I suspect she was sincere, too, with the JNESS and DOS bullshit. And likely was convinced that branding women with her lord and master’s initials really was the road to female empowerment.

          People’s capacity to hold contradictory beliefs in their heads can be staggering. Religion is a classic example, modern educated people believing in fairy tales about angels and virgin births and burning bushes that talk. People with PhDs in the sciences who don’t believe in Evolution because it goes against Bible teaching. Millions of people believe the Bible is the literal word of God, perfectly decent people who wouldn’t hurt a fly and yet can read Leviticus without a qualm, with its instructions on how properly to beat your slaves and how witches are to be killed and how to stone your bride to death in front of her father’s house should she turn out not to be a virgin on your wedding night. People have a deep irrational streak; there’s nothing necessarily wrong with that, we are not Spock. But it’s a good idea to keep a careful eye on one’s irrational tendencies, lest one find oneself falling down the rabbit hole.

          • “Allison Mack was onboard with this, while proclaiming her feminist goals, all about empowerment. I suspect she was sincere, too, with the JNESS and DOS bullshit. And likely was convinced that branding women with her lord and master’s initials really was the road to female empowerment. ”

            First of all, everyone was onboard…why just posting (again) against Allison.

            She was manipulated mentally like Dani and the others.

            The funny thing is it’s perfectly accepted about the others that they were ‘brainwashed’ but Allison was onboard…

            Second, stop with the branding, like she was behind it…It’s a known fact now that she has Nothing to do with it and was at the same level as other about it…

            How about you search another subject of obsession…better yet, get a life and stop with obsessions all together.

        • Bizarre head-covering memory from my lost youth: I was a girl going to a Catholic school attached to the neighborhood church in the 60s. On the day Jack Kennedy was shot, they herded the entire elementary school out of class and into the church. Because it was an unplanned situation, most of the girls had nothing to cover our hair. So we were each given a kleenex and a bobby pin as we entered the sanctuary. Couldn’t have 12-yr-olds praying for the president with bare heads!

  • What a coincidence that emiliano salINAS GOT MARRIED IN THE same restaurant she worked!!!
    …NOT!
    This is typical psycopath behavior where they return to hoover you and bring you back in. Stalking behvaior to the max

    Congrats Daniela on getting out and realizing that you are the owner of your life. This is a do-it yourself life.
    Congratulations for being brave. Keep fighting. La lucha sigue. Tus admiradoras de Mexico

    • Affirmative!!!

    • It’s probably a coincidence. Dani should try and stay out of the Salinas shadow and not public mention the Salinas name publicly.

      There is nothing that can be gained from attacking Salinas. Let sleeping dogs lie and do not twist the lion’s tail….

      ….Unless of course your name is Frank Parlato 😉

      • That’s the problem, far too many people cower and expect Frank to work miracles all by himself.

      • THERE ARE BILLIONS OF PLACES TO GET MARRIED IN MEXICO. what are the odds they would go exactly to where she works? considering keith wrote the wedding vows for other nxvims i could see how he could convince emiliano to get married where he wanted and when he wanted. it is called hoovering. classic psycopath behavior. they never let you go. like the hoover vacum they want to suck u back in.

  • Dani is as tough as nails.

    By way of contrast how come the RACKET WOMEN Lauren Salzman and Allison Mack are such groveling, sniveling powder puffs?
    (If Elton John is the Rocket Man, then Lauren Salzman and Allison Mack are the RACKET WOMEN.)
    The Racket Women liked advertising how they were “bad ass warrior bitches.”

  • Daniela,

    You are an incredible tenacious individual and quite inspiring. I wish all that this life has to offer.

  • “How are you going with your program?” What? Did she cause enough destruction in Dani’s life already?? She just can’t stop no matter what! This clearly demonstrates Lauren Salzman is precisely the same as a Terminator killing machine. She has been encoded with one program and one program only, to destroy innocent lives and not stop until she’s stopped permanently. I am fully convinced all her tears in Court were an act, just like a Terminator can take up the voice of any human being. Lauren Salzman should be put to death. It is the only acceptable solution, the only ethical solution for the genuine advancement of humanity.

    • Salzman was not accused of committing a capital crime.

    • Alex,

      Lauren Salzman had fake tears and also trashed Allison Mack on the witness stand.

      I have a funny feeling when Allison Mack(an actual professional actress) takes the stand Lauren Salzman is going to find out payback is a bitch!

      Pardon the pun.

      It ate over till ‘Cankles’ or the fat woman sings!

  • Wow Dani!!! You are such brave and a strong-soul woman! You certainly are building a better world with your testimony. Thanks God you had such a revelation of his love for life and hope through that little robin who transmitted confidence and a strong desire for living your own life , for pursuing your own self without codependencies, in pure freedom. I send you a big tremendous hug.

  • Daniela described a really insecure maniac and sexual deviant.

    Here’s what REALLY surprises me…

    How could a woman like Toni Natalie or Barb Bouchey love and worship a man like Keith for YEARS?

    These women didn’t leave Keith when they were younger. Nope.

    They only decided to leave Keith after living with him for YEARS and eventually being ‘downgraded’ as ‘aging girlfriends’ —- when Keith began fucking younger women and was no longer paying them as much attention as he once did.

    These women are not heroes IMO. They are women who simply outlived their usefulness to Keith and became older girlfriends who no longer commanded Keith’s same attention. Just like yesterday’s garbage, they were fodder for the garbage dump.

    You could tell from the love letter that Keith wrote to Toni (to try and get her back) that he really didn’t give a shit about her, it was simply his EGO that couldn’t handle being dumped so he wanted her back for that reason.

    Dani is a hero. Not Toni or Barb. 🙂

    • Just to go further with Bangkookery’s comments. Didn’t anyone who had been around him that long know that he was doing very evil things? Why didn’t they go to the authorities. I know the NXIVM 9 tried to make a stand and that matters – however long before that Keith was doing horrible things. Why didn’t anyone hold him accountable? I really don’t understand. And even between 2010 and 2018, why didn’t anyone do anything significant. Anyone who spent any serious time with Keith would have seen some of this stuff. I really don’t get it. People who were around him then, feel free to chime in. You are anonymous. But I think all of us want to know why all of you allowed the evil to go on as long as it did.

      • FR Reader in MO

        Someone replied yesterday to one of the installments that they were around and knew her and had no idea these things were happening.

      • Frank started this website and was covering NXIVM in 2015. That is significant.

      • Because the local law enforcement didn’t care. They had them in their back pocket. They were able to buy influence in the area. And anyone who spoke out about, or wrote the truth about NX either had their lives destroyed with litigation, or were thrown in jail.

    • “How could a woman like Toni Natalie or Barb Bouchey love and worship a man like Keith for YEARS?”

      The same question holds for all of the women willing to enslave themselves to Raniere.

      • Raniere had a lot of help from several others, mostly women.

      • The same way he could have Toni Natalie — back before he knew her well at all — come into a room with him under the pretense of just curing her cigarette habit, while her then husband waited outside. She comes out and her husband says What took so long? And she says What are you talking about? I was in there for 20 minutes. And her husband tells her she was in the room for TWO AND A HALF HOURS.

        The outcome of this mysterious time she had in this room with him (that she doesn’t remember the bulk of), is that I believe (correct me if I’m wrong someone) she did quit smoking.
        But she also left that husband and ended up with Keith. And the rest is her sordid history with NIVM.

        He was clearly gifted at hypnosis…NLP…. whatever. That’s how he could get people to do things.

    • I can only think that Raniere had the ability to sniff out people’s vulnerabilities and exploit them. So it was about finding dysfunctional people he could easily turn to the dark side. Allison Smack seemed to be absolutely desperate to be liked, no idea who she was, lost, and not very intelligent. “”Oh, he’s the most intelligent man in the world, maybe he can make me more intelligent. For not “not very intelligent” read stupid and clueless, with a hang up about being stupid and clueless. Dani was of a much higher calibre than Raniere’s evil idiot women. When it comes right right down to it, she was smarter than Raniere.

      • And who is the other idiot and High School Dropout that recruited Allison Whack?

        Our good ole Kristin Kook.

        Morons of a feather, fail together!

        • Kristin graduated Eric Hamber High School in Vancouver in the year 2000. This information is easily accessible on the Internet.

          • What’s the point

            Wow. So obvious this is Sultan. You might as well just post here under that name instead of cutting and pasting the whole site to Twitter. That really makes no sense. Says he’s leaving the site yet comes here everyday and reads every article so he can respond and then post on Twitter. What’s the point?

          • What's the point

            What’s the point of anyone posting clearly false info about anyone?
            What’s the point of you defending their falsehoods?
            What’s the point of criticizing those who correct them?
            What’s the point of you mistakenly claiming they are your obsession, Sultan?
            What’s the point of you criticizing Sultan HERE when you can debate him on his twitter site?

            Are you afraid to “face” him, even thru the safety of the internet? Are you that much of a wuss? Perhaps a course of SOP will grow you some balls.

          • Thanks, Sultan.

            Thanks for confirming you are Sultan. Also looks like your twitter account is down. Good luck with that.

      • “Allison Smack seemed to be absolutely desperate to be liked, no idea who she was, lost, and not very intelligent. “”Oh, he’s the most intelligent man in the world, maybe he can make me more intelligent. For not “not very intelligent” read stupid and clueless, with a hang up about being stupid and clueless. ”

        You’ve hit the nail on the head.
        Allison Mack is desperate to be adored and she has a very fragile ego.
        Mack is basically a Narcissist.
        And after looking through her social media I can see that she is very sensitive about not having a college education.
        Allison had the money and the time to attend college and yet never had the discipline and determination to take college courses.
        Not even community college courses.
        I know lots of women who hold down a part time job and go to college.
        And these women have very definite goals in life.
        Today women are more likely to graduate from college than men.
        But Allison Mack will maybe have the opportunity to take college classes in prison where she belongs.

    • Toni got the hell out of dodge once she slowly threw away her lover’s goggles which often takes some time and then saw VanFake for who he really was.

      Dumbass.

      Just go away. I have no idea why Frank even gives you a platform. You’re shtick is boring and you seem like an acerbic douche.

    • You are wrong as always, specially with Toni Natalie. She was raped by Raniere many times as he became more and mire crazy with the years. Her brother had to intervene so that Keith would let her go, after he used Bronfman money to drestroy her in the courts.

      • You just contradicted the “Anonymous” comment above yours and why did it take being raped by Raniere “many times” and her brother’s intervention to dump him if she wasn’t clueless?

    • Bangkok,

      “Daniela described a really insecure maniac and sexual deviant”.

      Dani could have been describing you, Bangkok. 😉

      Fortunately you never leave your parent’s basement apartment so Society could care less about your sorry ass 🙁

      Have a nice weekend playing Fortnight!!!!!
      😉

      If you get bored this weekend you can always stick your junk in a light socket…

      ….Or sell your blood plasma at the local hospital and actually make money. Your mom and dad will be so proud even if it’s not a real job. 😉

  • Reading Daniela’s testimony consecutively has much more impact than reading it piecemeal. Her time as a witness on the stand has been honest, detailed and powerful. What a long, hard trip it has been for Daniela. She is now a genuine example of strength, probably strength that she had to keep mustering over and over again, all on her own and against horrible odds. These Nxivm/ DOS sickos schemed and conspired to destroy the last of her adolescence and to divide and conquer her family. Yet she has worked hard not only to make a life for herself but has had the courage to come and testify with tremendous, intelligent conscientiousness.

    It’s incredible to even try justifying such abuse and torment being dealt out by Raniere and his worshipful groupies, including Daniela’s parents, as minions who didn’t bother to love or watch over the wellbeing of their own four children. Three daughters were doled out to Raniere to satisfy his perversions, which will never be satisfied. That is part of his pathology, that Raniere would be compelled to keep escalating. Any fool can see that the manufactured self-help movement acted as a profitable front to recruit new flesh and to cover for Raniere’s perversions. And Raniere couldn’t keep his shitheap behind closed doors, so he’s in captivity, as befits him.

    Agnifilo and Raniere’s whole defense team have to know that they are attempting to defend the indefensible. We have heard that Agnifilo tried and tried to get Raniere to cop a plea. That has not been hidden, so even Agnifilo holds the awareness that his client and his entire inner cult are criminally guilty. Why bother with any adversarial cross-examination?

    Agnifilo went down that road already and was stopped from badgering (the guilty) Lauren Salzman, after ignoring warnings from the bench. Maybe he ought to ask Raniere to eat his fucking post-it notes. Even Agnifilo can see Raniere’s constant compulsion to have the last word for what it is, the desperate ramblings of megalomania. The defense team doesn’t need to bother to embarrass itself any more than already has. Raniere is another Charles Manson, only with mo’ money.

    • This is the torture that Clare Bronfman has called a great benefit to the world. As she skates away on her money supply and her sister sits snugly, are either of them having second thoughts? Or are they still choosing to be hoodlums for the sake of Raniere and his genitalia? What is this, live long and slobber?

  • Dani testified, “I realized I was not going to change the world” …

    I take exception to this point she made in reference to some years ago.

    Now, as of today, she has no idea how important she was in all of this. She is a heroine. Well done!

  • FYI, actress/singer Jann Arden was in NXIVM. Did’ya know that?

    • As is the case with many groups that enjoy a certain popularity, a lot of people will do one or more introductory or lower-level courses, but that doesn’t necessarily make them “in” the group. In some ways, that can even play into the group’s hand by giving them more credit than they deserve for being a significant influence.

      If the commonly cited figure is correct, close to 20,000 people did at least a NXIVM introductory program, and yet probably fewer than 1,000 ended up as dedicated long-term adherents. That’s a fairly typical attrition rate; groups typically cycle through a large number of recruits, some even under social or work pressure to try courses, in order to winnow out a small group of diehards.

      Do you know just what courses Arden did?

    • So what? A lot of people “were in” NXIVM. There’s quite a difference between taking a course or two and get cauterized for a half hour.

    • Wild horses won’t make Jann Arden admit it now.

  • Dani your dream was to change the world for the better…..my dear girl you have done more with your testimony then I think any of us can imagine. You are one of the most bravest, strongest and inspirational person that I have encounter in my life. I hope you now get to experience all the wonderful things this world has to offer because I don’t believe there is anyone who deserves them more.

  • What kind of parents do this to their children?

    I stopped complaining about my parents a long time ago when I realized they did the best they could do and it was up to me as an adult to make my way.

    This is abusive parental behavior to the extreme. What assholes they are still to this day. At least Dani’s mom has made an effort. Her dad, WTF Hector? You are a disgrace to the meaning of fatherhood.

  • They all use this same schtick…change the world, whether it be religion, philosophy, ideology, politics, etc.

    Just live and enjoy life. Follow no man, or woman.
    Be bold. Live your best life because the time we have is all too short.

  • Thanks to you, too, for confirming you have NOTHING to add, no mention of facts, just continuously childishly and mistakenly claiming you see your obsession.
    I’ll deal with you on your intellectual level: I’m rubber and you’re glue, it bounces off me and sticks to you.

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